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	<title>Comments on: What&#8217;s All the HubBub? Roughly Drafted Article on SproutCore&#8230; Some Key Points to Consider</title>
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	<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/</link>
	<description>Design, Development, Technology and My Life.</description>
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		<title>By: Cheap Flights Guy</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-94462</link>
		<dc:creator>Cheap Flights Guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Feb 2009 22:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-94462</guid>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting point of view, but one that I don&#8217;t think many people share:</p>
<p>&#8220;I don‚Äôt think I could seriously recommend building any application of importance or scale with a JS framework&#8221;. These days, a lot of the &#8216;big&#8217; sites rely on a js framework. I just checked CNN.com and they are using prototype, ESPN.com are using jquery. And I think this trend is going to continue as these frameworks become more stable.</p>
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		<title>By: John Dowdell</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-36017</link>
		<dc:creator>John Dowdell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:37:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-36017</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;&quot;This is where the concept of SproutCore or any other JS framework being called a &#039;platform&#039; kinda gets thrown out the window. Without the dependability of rendering, behavior and developer creature comforts afforded by a binary compiled file that runs in a plug-in ala Flash or Silverlight, there is no platform.&quot;&lt;/em&gt;

Good line, thanks. Supporting multiple runtimes is hard. 

JavaScript is still very useful. But when building something atop varied JavaScript &amp; CSS engines, you&#039;re still bound by their intersection. As we go to mobile browsing, things get wild&#039;n&#039;wooly again, and few JavaScript frameworks yet describe which Linux browsers support them. A new abstraction layer doesn&#039;t change the underlying capabilities, only the access methods to those existing capabilities.

re the Twitter &quot;proprietary&quot; thing, I noticed in the original article that Flash was dismissed on the basis of &quot;proprietary&quot;, but I was baffled why someone with that perspective would lock themselves into Apple&#039;s hardware/software stack, or into Google&#039;s database stack. Both of those are scarier, to me, than in not having runtime sourcecode, which you couldn&#039;t use to modify someone else&#039;s experience anyway!

(Welcome back to the land of the fully-living, btw. ;-)

jd/adobe</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>&#8220;This is where the concept of SproutCore or any other JS framework being called a &#8216;platform&#8217; kinda gets thrown out the window. Without the dependability of rendering, behavior and developer creature comforts afforded by a binary compiled file that runs in a plug-in ala Flash or Silverlight, there is no platform.&#8221;</em></p>
<p>Good line, thanks. Supporting multiple runtimes is hard. </p>
<p>JavaScript is still very useful. But when building something atop varied JavaScript &amp; CSS engines, you&#8217;re still bound by their intersection. As we go to mobile browsing, things get wild&#8217;n'wooly again, and few JavaScript frameworks yet describe which Linux browsers support them. A new abstraction layer doesn&#8217;t change the underlying capabilities, only the access methods to those existing capabilities.</p>
<p>re the Twitter &#8220;proprietary&#8221; thing, I noticed in the original article that Flash was dismissed on the basis of &#8220;proprietary&#8221;, but I was baffled why someone with that perspective would lock themselves into Apple&#8217;s hardware/software stack, or into Google&#8217;s database stack. Both of those are scarier, to me, than in not having runtime sourcecode, which you couldn&#8217;t use to modify someone else&#8217;s experience anyway!</p>
<p>(Welcome back to the land of the fully-living, btw. <img src='http://visualrinse.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>jd/adobe</p>
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		<title>By: Chad</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-36016</link>
		<dc:creator>Chad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 18:33:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-36016</guid>
		<description>This dicussion thread at Macrumors shows how very little most people know about how Flash/JS or Silverlight works... Just something else to read on the subject. 
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=501128</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This dicussion thread at Macrumors shows how very little most people know about how Flash/JS or Silverlight works&#8230; Just something else to read on the subject.<br />
<a href="http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=501128" rel="nofollow">http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=501128</a></p>
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		<title>By: Apple's open secret: SproutCore is Cocoa for the Web - MacTalk Forums</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-36012</link>
		<dc:creator>Apple's open secret: SproutCore is Cocoa for the Web - MacTalk Forums</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 17:47:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-36012</guid>
		<description>[...] Posted by Nathanh   wow, adobe are in trouble.    I don&#039;t know about that. Have a read of this for more info.  __________________ &#63743; C2D MBP 17&quot; 2.4GHz Glossy &#63743; 17&quot; G4 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Posted by Nathanh   wow, adobe are in trouble.    I don&#8217;t know about that. Have a read of this for more info.  __________________ &#63743; C2D MBP 17&quot; 2.4GHz Glossy &#63743; 17&quot; G4 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chad</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-36011</link>
		<dc:creator>Chad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 17:47:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-36011</guid>
		<description>Edward, you may be correct about the potential for Mac platform abandonment, no denying that. However, Linux has never once factored into a client&#039;s project requirements for me. That&#039;s right, in a decade of professional design and development, I have never once had a client&#039;s project need to be available on Linux. I realize that sounds callous. Maybe even financially reckless or at least shortsighted. There is no denying that Linux stands to gain marketshare due to MS&#039;s complete botch of Vista and the mess that IE6 and IE7 fragmentation has caused. Flash is available for Linux. AIR for Linux is coming I believe. What this post is really about is ensuring uniform display and behaviour across the widest marketshare of the audience. With Linux on the desktop having a share significantly smaller than Macs (which is just as statistically small when compared to Windows), it just doesn&#039;t factor into this equation.

I mainly countered with Silverlight vs. Sproutcore as a lesser of two evils. Everyone who reads this regularly knows I would probably write a Flex app first.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Edward, you may be correct about the potential for Mac platform abandonment, no denying that. However, Linux has never once factored into a client&#8217;s project requirements for me. That&#8217;s right, in a decade of professional design and development, I have never once had a client&#8217;s project need to be available on Linux. I realize that sounds callous. Maybe even financially reckless or at least shortsighted. There is no denying that Linux stands to gain marketshare due to MS&#8217;s complete botch of Vista and the mess that IE6 and IE7 fragmentation has caused. Flash is available for Linux. AIR for Linux is coming I believe. What this post is really about is ensuring uniform display and behaviour across the widest marketshare of the audience. With Linux on the desktop having a share significantly smaller than Macs (which is just as statistically small when compared to Windows), it just doesn&#8217;t factor into this equation.</p>
<p>I mainly countered with Silverlight vs. Sproutcore as a lesser of two evils. Everyone who reads this regularly knows I would probably write a Flex app first.</p>
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		<title>By: Edward</title>
		<link>http://visualrinse.com/2008/06/16/whats-all-the-hubbub-roughly-drafted-article-on-sproutcore-some-key-points-to-consider/comment-page-1/#comment-36008</link>
		<dc:creator>Edward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 17:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://visualrinse.com/?p=365#comment-36008</guid>
		<description>If you would be taking a proprietary (Silverlight) approach remind me to never hire you to code a website.  Silverlight is cross-platform Mac/Windows only.  Linux is in the dark, and Mac will probably only be supported until MS gets enough market penetration to cause some havoc just like with IE.  So enjoy your trojan horse.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you would be taking a proprietary (Silverlight) approach remind me to never hire you to code a website.  Silverlight is cross-platform Mac/Windows only.  Linux is in the dark, and Mac will probably only be supported until MS gets enough market penetration to cause some havoc just like with IE.  So enjoy your trojan horse.</p>
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